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	<title>Comments on: What Would You Teach a Bunch of Lawyers About The Web?</title>
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	<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/</link>
	<description>Huge iPhone and web geek. Selfish, Obsessive, and Easily Distracted.</description>
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		<title>By: David Hobbie</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-101015</link>
		<dc:creator>David Hobbie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 07 Mar 2009 15:01:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-101015</guid>
		<description>You&#039;ve left out two major areas and a significant resource.

First major area. I would explain wikis.  Lawyers are interested in aggregations of knowledge, and it&#039;s important to understand this (relatively) new approach to collaboration.  Lawyers use Wikipedia so you can enter the discussion that way. You can explain that just as a blog is a one-to-many publication tool, a wiki is a way for many people to work on the same project or document.

Second major area.  These tools are not simply out there on the web.  Web tools are starting to be used inside law firms as part of the general &quot;Enterprise 2.0&quot; move of social software from the Web to inside the firewall.  While large law firms may have the staff to investigate such tools, there may be significant opportunities inside smaller firms and law departments, where there has been less investment and structure around legacy systems, in this area.  One Canadian firm for instance implemented a wiki system in place of a traditional document management system.

Resource.  Although it is no longer kept up-to-date, I highly  recommend my former colleague Doug Cornelius&#039; blog KM Space http://kmspace.blogspot.com/.  He delves in-depth into each of the tools you mention from a lawyer and knowledge management practitioner&#039;s perspective.  

I&#039;m at @KMHobbie if you want more thoughts.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;ve left out two major areas and a significant resource.</p>
<p>First major area. I would explain wikis.  Lawyers are interested in aggregations of knowledge, and it&#8217;s important to understand this (relatively) new approach to collaboration.  Lawyers use Wikipedia so you can enter the discussion that way. You can explain that just as a blog is a one-to-many publication tool, a wiki is a way for many people to work on the same project or document.</p>
<p>Second major area.  These tools are not simply out there on the web.  Web tools are starting to be used inside law firms as part of the general &#8220;Enterprise 2.0&#8243; move of social software from the Web to inside the firewall.  While large law firms may have the staff to investigate such tools, there may be significant opportunities inside smaller firms and law departments, where there has been less investment and structure around legacy systems, in this area.  One Canadian firm for instance implemented a wiki system in place of a traditional document management system.</p>
<p>Resource.  Although it is no longer kept up-to-date, I highly  recommend my former colleague Doug Cornelius&#8217; blog KM Space <a href="http://kmspace.blogspot.com/" rel="nofollow">http://kmspace.blogspot.com/</a>.  He delves in-depth into each of the tools you mention from a lawyer and knowledge management practitioner&#8217;s perspective.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m at @KMHobbie if you want more thoughts.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Spence</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100766</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Spence</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 04 Mar 2009 17:46:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100766</guid>
		<description>This goes beyond your area of expertise but I am always wary of the intersection of social tools and the Bar&#039;s ethics rules.  For example, when I was still posting on portlandsmallbusiness.com, I was constantly watering down the content for fear that someone would rely on it as legal advice.  What I ended up with was not very interesting for the reader and frustrating for me.  I found the safest thing was to post legislative updates and a few brief comments on it rather than delving into more substantive issues.

Twitter is easier to use but quickly becomes over whelming. 

Another potential problem with using social tools is the economic model of most law firms.  Most firms bill by the hour.  An hour spent blogging or tweeting is an hour not spent billing a client.  I&#039;m sure you can see the conflict here.  The lawyers that would probably be most capable of utilizing social tools --because the probably already use them in their private life- and integrating them into their workdays are probably junior or mid-level associates.  In many firms these associates have hourly billing quotas.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This goes beyond your area of expertise but I am always wary of the intersection of social tools and the Bar&#8217;s ethics rules.  For example, when I was still posting on portlandsmallbusiness.com, I was constantly watering down the content for fear that someone would rely on it as legal advice.  What I ended up with was not very interesting for the reader and frustrating for me.  I found the safest thing was to post legislative updates and a few brief comments on it rather than delving into more substantive issues.</p>
<p>Twitter is easier to use but quickly becomes over whelming. </p>
<p>Another potential problem with using social tools is the economic model of most law firms.  Most firms bill by the hour.  An hour spent blogging or tweeting is an hour not spent billing a client.  I&#8217;m sure you can see the conflict here.  The lawyers that would probably be most capable of utilizing social tools &#8211;because the probably already use them in their private life- and integrating them into their workdays are probably junior or mid-level associates.  In many firms these associates have hourly billing quotas.</p>
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		<title>By: JoAnn Lee Kohl</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100689</link>
		<dc:creator>JoAnn Lee Kohl</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 22:43:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100689</guid>
		<description>Josh, thanks for the fantastic presentation on social web tools to a bunch of lawyers at Stoel Rives!  It was a great introduction and got us 20th century types thinking about social tools in a new way.

As mentioned, we&#039;re in the process of developing our internal policies, procedures, and guidelines (after all, we are a big stodgy organization that has to control everything :-)) regarding social networking, and I&#039;m hopeful that the powers that be will take into consideration your recommendations for successful community building (openness and transparency, having a personal identity, remembering that social networking is a conversation and not a monologue, etc.) when drafting our policies.

One of the challenges that lawyers face is that, even though we&#039;d love to keep it real and personal and be open in providing helpful, valuable content, we have to be careful not to run afowl of the ethical rules governing lawyer communications (restrictions on advertising &amp; solicitation and negative consequences of accidentally forming an attorney-client relationship).  I&#039;d love to petition the ABA and state bar associations to relax some of the rules that I think are outdated, but that&#039;s just not going to happen in my lifetime.

Many thanks for the advice!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Josh, thanks for the fantastic presentation on social web tools to a bunch of lawyers at Stoel Rives!  It was a great introduction and got us 20th century types thinking about social tools in a new way.</p>
<p>As mentioned, we&#8217;re in the process of developing our internal policies, procedures, and guidelines (after all, we are a big stodgy organization that has to control everything <img src='http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> ) regarding social networking, and I&#8217;m hopeful that the powers that be will take into consideration your recommendations for successful community building (openness and transparency, having a personal identity, remembering that social networking is a conversation and not a monologue, etc.) when drafting our policies.</p>
<p>One of the challenges that lawyers face is that, even though we&#8217;d love to keep it real and personal and be open in providing helpful, valuable content, we have to be careful not to run afowl of the ethical rules governing lawyer communications (restrictions on advertising &amp; solicitation and negative consequences of accidentally forming an attorney-client relationship).  I&#8217;d love to petition the ABA and state bar associations to relax some of the rules that I think are outdated, but that&#8217;s just not going to happen in my lifetime.</p>
<p>Many thanks for the advice!</p>
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		<title>By: Steven Walling</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100674</link>
		<dc:creator>Steven Walling</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 19:40:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100674</guid>
		<description>I think you&#039;ve covered the finer points extremely well, but I think it would be really important, either before or after you delve in to the info above, to state affirmatively that the real core difference on the Web is that they can&#039;t control it. 

My uneducated guess would be that a lot of lawyers would seek to manage digital interactions and communications with the same rigor that they do their other work. While teaching them about tools, personalities, and organizations influential on the Web is a must, I think the larger point to hammer in is that attempting to manage things online in the same way they do in meatspace is not only likely to fail, it will probably reflect very poorly on them and their clients.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you&#8217;ve covered the finer points extremely well, but I think it would be really important, either before or after you delve in to the info above, to state affirmatively that the real core difference on the Web is that they can&#8217;t control it. </p>
<p>My uneducated guess would be that a lot of lawyers would seek to manage digital interactions and communications with the same rigor that they do their other work. While teaching them about tools, personalities, and organizations influential on the Web is a must, I think the larger point to hammer in is that attempting to manage things online in the same way they do in meatspace is not only likely to fail, it will probably reflect very poorly on them and their clients.</p>
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		<title>By: Francine Geller</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100673</link>
		<dc:creator>Francine Geller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 19:14:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100673</guid>
		<description>Josh, this looks comprehensive. I may start off discussing what Web 2.0 is and the ability to effectively network and market their legal expertise through various social media chanels.

In regards to the web, what about the importance of SEO and SEM to allow them to reach their target markets through all of the noise? 
Search Engine Rountable at http://www.seroundtable.com/
Post on Traffic from Social Media vs. Search http://snipr.com/d0qcu 

And... I agree with Kelly&#039;s comment - a personal identity for corporate efforts is key...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Josh, this looks comprehensive. I may start off discussing what Web 2.0 is and the ability to effectively network and market their legal expertise through various social media chanels.</p>
<p>In regards to the web, what about the importance of SEO and SEM to allow them to reach their target markets through all of the noise?<br />
Search Engine Rountable at <a href="http://www.seroundtable.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.seroundtable.com/</a><br />
Post on Traffic from Social Media vs. Search <a href="http://snipr.com/d0qcu" rel="nofollow">http://snipr.com/d0qcu</a> </p>
<p>And&#8230; I agree with Kelly&#8217;s comment &#8211; a personal identity for corporate efforts is key&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Francine Geller</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100672</link>
		<dc:creator>Francine Geller</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 19:05:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100672</guid>
		<description>Your outline looks comprehensive. 

I would start out with an overview of what Web 2.0 is including the key element of interactivity that allows them to effectively network and market their legal expertise and knowledge. 

In regards to the web, what about including the important of SEO and SEM in regards to reaching their target markets through all of the noise?
Search Engine Roundtable at http://www.seroundtable.com/
Post on comparing results of social media and search http://snipr.com/d0pio

Good luck today!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your outline looks comprehensive. </p>
<p>I would start out with an overview of what Web 2.0 is including the key element of interactivity that allows them to effectively network and market their legal expertise and knowledge. </p>
<p>In regards to the web, what about including the important of SEO and SEM in regards to reaching their target markets through all of the noise?<br />
Search Engine Roundtable at <a href="http://www.seroundtable.com/" rel="nofollow">http://www.seroundtable.com/</a><br />
Post on comparing results of social media and search <a href="http://snipr.com/d0pio" rel="nofollow">http://snipr.com/d0pio</a></p>
<p>Good luck today!</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron Eiche</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100671</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron Eiche</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 19:05:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100671</guid>
		<description>I think I would try to impress upon them the distribution of individual information over the web. Not in a scary Big-brother type of fashion, but just know that information disseminates through all kinds of different methods, people, aggregators, blogs, search-engines. 

Even though I advertise myself pretty prominently on the web, I didn&#039;t think anyone was taking that seriously. We had some friends over for dinner not too long ago and I was a bit shocked to find out they&#039;d gone to my website, and googled me and the like. It never occurs to me to find stuff out about people I know.

Additionally, I think you might want to lead into the YRO/groklaw stuff noting that there is a portion of people who argue law applied to technology simply because they want to continue to engage in illicit behavior.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think I would try to impress upon them the distribution of individual information over the web. Not in a scary Big-brother type of fashion, but just know that information disseminates through all kinds of different methods, people, aggregators, blogs, search-engines. </p>
<p>Even though I advertise myself pretty prominently on the web, I didn&#8217;t think anyone was taking that seriously. We had some friends over for dinner not too long ago and I was a bit shocked to find out they&#8217;d gone to my website, and googled me and the like. It never occurs to me to find stuff out about people I know.</p>
<p>Additionally, I think you might want to lead into the YRO/groklaw stuff noting that there is a portion of people who argue law applied to technology simply because they want to continue to engage in illicit behavior.</p>
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		<title>By: Kelly Guimont</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100670</link>
		<dc:creator>Kelly Guimont</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 18:49:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100670</guid>
		<description>I think you have it covered as far as info. EXCELLENT resources all collected in one place!

Mostly what I think people who are new to social media (or even just any sort of &quot;official web presence&quot;) need to know is that it is ok to have a human face on their corporate identity. That&#039;s what a lot of people seem to resist. It is ok and in fact encouraged!

Otherwise you FULLY rocked this!! Superb post.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think you have it covered as far as info. EXCELLENT resources all collected in one place!</p>
<p>Mostly what I think people who are new to social media (or even just any sort of &#8220;official web presence&#8221;) need to know is that it is ok to have a human face on their corporate identity. That&#8217;s what a lot of people seem to resist. It is ok and in fact encouraged!</p>
<p>Otherwise you FULLY rocked this!! Superb post.</p>
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		<title>By: John G Bell</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100669</link>
		<dc:creator>John G Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 18:42:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100669</guid>
		<description>Oh, and SCOTUSblog: http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Oh, and SCOTUSblog: <a href="http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/" rel="nofollow">http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/</a></p>
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		<title>By: John G Bell</title>
		<link>http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/2009/03/what-would-you-teach-a-bunch-of-lawyers-about-the-web/comment-page-1/#comment-100668</link>
		<dc:creator>John G Bell</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 03 Mar 2009 18:37:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinyscreenfuls.com/?p=2833#comment-100668</guid>
		<description>Something not mentioned in the post, I would definitely introduce them to the cache feature of Google, and the Wayback Machine. Knowing that past versions are around is something they may find very interesting.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Something not mentioned in the post, I would definitely introduce them to the cache feature of Google, and the Wayback Machine. Knowing that past versions are around is something they may find very interesting.</p>
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